Virginia Motor Sport Club Discussion Forums

Results => Autocross => Topic started by: rays on October 04, 2009, 06:31:27 PM



Title: BRR-VMSC Challenge Results
Post by: rays on October 04, 2009, 06:31:27 PM
Results are here...

http://www.brr-scca.org/results.html


Ray


Title: Re: BRR-VMSC Challenge Results
Post by: jloehlein on October 04, 2009, 07:26:12 PM
Hey Ray,

Out of curiosity, how was the challenge scored?  From my quick look at the results, it looks like you took your fastest 18 drivers versus all 18 of our drivers.  In the past, I thought we had taken top 10 from each club and averaged them.

If you did score the results as all 18 VMSC members against the best 18 BRR members, I do not that that is a valid comparison.  The odds will be heavily stacked in the favor of the host club if this is the way these get scored.  Think of it like this, I shuffle a deck of cards, I tell you that you can pick 5 cards and I get to pick 15 (signifying one club having lower turnout), I then get to put together the best 5-card hand that I can to compare against your hand...I'll win almost all the time.

I think there are two better options to score the Challenge:

1) Average PAX of all club members.  This incents each club to only invite the fastest members (imagine if Jeff Chenery was the only VMSC member to show up...we would win) and therefore I do not think it should be used.

2) Top X in PAX from each club.  This slightly favors the home team, but not as heavily as the way I described above.  I recommend this way, as long as we can come up with a number...I like the number 10.

Anyways, I've taken the top 10 in PAX from your VMSC/BRR 18-driver per club list and done the math (see attachment).  You guys still end up winning (congrats), but only by a tenth of a second...not 6 tenths of a second.  Let me know if I am mistaken in my assumption that you compared all 18 VMSC members against the fastest 18 BRR members.  I'd like to document somewhere how we want to score these so that we remember next time :)


Title: Re: BRR-VMSC Challenge Results
Post by: gunny on October 04, 2009, 07:55:33 PM
To all,
I had a great time! The course really drove different than it walked! (to me anyways) So I learned a lot today and had a blast trying to keep up. I'm uploading pictures now and its going to take a while. I will post a link tomorrow.

Gunny


Title: Congrats to BRR for there victory in the BRR-VMSC Challenge
Post by: JCHVMSC on October 04, 2009, 09:04:50 PM
We had great VMSC turnout today and fought a hard battle but our friends at BRR were victorious today - CONGRATULATIONS

They won by a tight margin as these events usually are close. The course was fast and challenging and a lot of folks stepped up with great runs (not me unfortunately...well they were ok except for those pesky orange people)

Thanks to all the VMSC folks who were able to make the trip and to our BRR friends who hosted a great challenge event

John Harmon
President, VMSC


Title: Re: BRR-VMSC Challenge Results
Post by: rays on October 05, 2009, 03:44:23 AM
Hey Ray,

Out of curiosity, how was the challenge scored?  From my quick look at the results, it looks like you took your fastest 18 drivers versus all 18 of our drivers.  In the past, I thought we had taken top 10 from each club and averaged them.

If you did score the results as all 18 VMSC members against the best 18 BRR members, I do not that that is a valid comparison.  The odds will be heavily stacked in the favor of the host club if this is the way these get scored.  Think of it like this, I shuffle a deck of cards, I tell you that you can pick 5 cards and I get to pick 15 (signifying one club having lower turnout), I then get to put together the best 5-card hand that I can to compare against your hand...I'll win almost all the time.

I think there are two better options to score the Challenge:

1) Average PAX of all club members.  This incents each club to only invite the fastest members (imagine if Jeff Chenery was the only VMSC member to show up...we would win) and therefore I do not think it should be used.

2) Top X in PAX from each club.  This slightly favors the home team, but not as heavily as the way I described above.  I recommend this way, as long as we can come up with a number...I like the number 10.

Anyways, I've taken the top 10 in PAX from your VMSC/BRR 18-driver per club list and done the math (see attachment).  You guys still end up winning (congrats), but only by a tenth of a second...not 6 tenths of a second.  Let me know if I am mistaken in my assumption that you compared all 18 VMSC members against the fastest 18 BRR members.  I'd like to document somewhere how we want to score these so that we remember next time :)

Well when you think about it what we did really isn't any different than your option #2 where the number is the number of drivers of the smaller team. Last year we only brought six guys so the number was six. It's simple and fair enough for what we are doing.

It's a great idea to document the rules. I wouldn't be opposed to coming up with a new formula as long as it is easy to calculate and understand. I wouldn't want this to turn into the BCS ;D

Ray


Title: Re: BRR-VMSC Challenge Results
Post by: jloehlein on October 05, 2009, 05:27:25 AM
Hey Ray, I'll shoot you an email so we don't clog up this thread.


Title: Re: BRR-VMSC Challenge Results
Post by: bernard on October 05, 2009, 02:18:54 PM
John's right, it was a good battle and fun event even though we came home empty handed. If anything let's worry about getting our guns loaded up for the next round and making sure we all bring our A-game.

If there is any consolation we did take FTD and FTPax.

Here's a video of my run too...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N08XyV1t7pA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N08XyV1t7pA)


Title: Re: BRR-VMSC Challenge Results
Post by: JCHVMSC on October 05, 2009, 07:33:55 PM
Here's a video of my best run (+1) with a little data included - Trackvision is the software that zips data and video together

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7tHVTKi94I

John



Title: Re: BRR-VMSC Challenge Results
Post by: gunny on October 05, 2009, 08:10:45 PM
Hey dont forget me, here is a vid of my best run!
If ever you guys get asked for a ride along and you don't feel like it send them my way! I like scaring them for a bit! I laugh and talk during my runs! It's fun for me to watch them back.  ;D . placing is not to much a concern for me! I just like to go fast and have fun. (who don't know that!) and if I can give a ride along to get them hooked then so be it (I did my little part in promoting the sport). (the more weight the better! LOL)
Fun Stuff

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NnsWtdNbWhI


Gunny




Title: Re: BRR-VMSC Challenge Results
Post by: mazda6guy on October 07, 2009, 05:34:00 PM
At the next Autox event I want a ride along please.  I need to be schooled on how to be a smooth operator. ??? 
Hey dont forget me, here is a vid of my best run!
If ever you guys get asked for a ride along and you don't feel like it send them my way! I like scaring them for a bit! I laugh and talk during my runs! It's fun for me to watch them back.  ;D . placing is not to much a concern for me! I just like to go fast and have fun. (who don't know that!) and if I can give a ride along to get them hooked then so be it (I did my little part in promoting the sport). (the more weight the better! LOL)
Fun Stuff

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NnsWtdNbWhI


Gunny





Title: Re: BRR-VMSC Challenge Results
Post by: gunny on October 12, 2009, 08:53:04 PM
Dunno How smooth I'll be but your more than welcome.
My best runs are at the end so thats when you want to ride along.

Gunny