Speed Regs and Comp Regs

[offset45]

The VMSC / BRR Challenge Autocross will be Nov 12 at RRC. Registration starts at 9:00 and the first car off will be at 11:00.  Members of both clubs are tentatively scheduled to run by class in the first 3 of 4 heats.  Non-members and novice classes will run in the fourth heat.  VMSC members register as usual on line.  BRR members register at your web site as usual. The goal is to have registratioons complete one week before the autocross.  The VMSC site should open soon.  Don't forget to correct your club affiliations if it is wrong on the registration form.

Looking forward to the start of a new tradition.

Charlie

[Autox]

Sweet!  When will we know the group run order?

[offset45]

Do you have a preference?

[Autox]

Not really.  Just curious.

Also, I am guessing the VMSC permanent numbers will not be valid for this event since BRR registers by number & class.  Is this correct?

[WWHEEE]

so do VMSC members have to phyically register?   or does the auto registration take place for them?

Am i locked in already for #74?

thanks

Rich

[Autox]

That's what I was asking

[rschumin]

Since car number is not going to determine running order for this event, then numbers only need to be unique within a class.  You can look at the BRR registration on myautoevents.com and see which numbers have been used.  We only have 20 signed up so I think the number of conflicts will be small.

I'll try to spend some time with Pasha this Sunday and talk through how we'll combine the data from the two registration systems.

I'm looking forward to this event. I think it will be a lot of fun. We put aside a date on next year's tentative schedule (check brr-scca.org)  for round two!!

[gpassut1]

We're running by "class"  
That means: all cars in any given class ex. SS's, the BP's, the STX's etc.  will run together in the same designated heat.  This sorting or grouping will be to Heats 1, 2 or 3 and will be done by the ODs.

The "heat" will be determined by the ODs when they can see how many cars and what classes are entered.  This might[/u] not be determined until day of the event to insure fairly even heats.

Our permanent number owners can run with their # to designate their car BUT it will not have anything to do with the running order of the day.

Yes, drivers with P.N.'s will be automatically pre-registered for this event....
If you are not coming, you need to cancel as you are always suppose to do.

We will probably designate Blue Ridge drivers with a #1xx number.

We will have all non-members and Novice Drivers run in heat 4.

This will give them time to audit the results and award the Challenege Trophy at the end of the Autocross.

This is the basic workings for the day...subject to any adjustments that might need to happen as this roles forward.

Our Club's pre-registration will open after our VMP Autocross this Sunday October 29th.

[prsrcokr]

Thanks for clarifying Genie, I was wondering if we'd have to show up and hope for a spot.
Brian

[lc]

What about passengers?  BRR-SCCA normally allows riders.. if none are going to be allowed then it should be announced in the drivers meeting so the BRR folks do not take on passengers.

[Chiketkd]

Originally posted by offset45Looking forward to the start of a new tradition.

Charlie

+1 I'm definitely looking forward to this healthy rivarly each year!

[mfbarnes]

Originally posted by lc
What about passengers?  BRR-SCCA normally allows riders.. if none are going to be allowed then it should be announced in the drivers meeting so the BRR folks do not take on passengers.

We have always allowed passengers.

Michael

[Autox]

Actually several years ago I believe the rule (whether written or just perceived) was that any passenger made the run a fun run.  There were some who were unhappy with that since they could not take their children or other family with them without being penalized.  

The rule was changed to be that if the rider is a non-competitor then it is not a fun run.

[rschumin]

Originally posted by Autox
Actually several years ago I believe the rule (whether written or just perceived) was that any passenger made the run a fun run.  There were some who were unhappy with that since they could not take their children or other family with them without being penalized.  

The rule was changed to be that if the rider is a non-competitor then it is not a fun run.

This is a point that should be clarified before the event. In BRR, ride alongs are  free. The only restrictions are that you have to be at least 12 and have a valid waiver. Anybody can ride with anybody at anytime without penalty. All runs count in the final standings.  

Does that give an opportunity for some drivers to see the course at speed before they run? Yup, sure does. We just choose not to worry about it.

I don't want to turn this into a debate about wether it is a competitive advantage or not.  It  probably is and that's why its not allowed in "big boy" (Nationals, Divisionals, etc) autocross.

This was discussed the BRR forum and I gave my understanding  of the VMSC rule;

"Anytime you take a passenger it becomes a "fun run" for the driver. In other words your time does not count in competition. If you ride before you drive all of your subsequent runs are fun runs."

I remember hearing that at a driver's meeting sometime in the past. If that's not right, I'm sure someone here can clear it up.

My opinion is that since we are playing in VMSC's sandbox, then VMSC should make the call on this.  The BRR group will be OK either way it goes. I agree with Lynn that we should decide about ride alongs and let everybody know before the event.

[gpassut1]

It will be reconfirmed at the Drivers Meeting but as Ray stated:

"Anytime you take a passenger it becomes a "fun run" for the driver. In other words your time does not count in competition. If you ride before you drive all of your subsequent runs are fun runs."  

is the rule we will be operating under.

[prsrcokr]

I wasn't aware passengers made runs count as fun runs, I figured if they weren't competitors it would be allowed and runs still counted.

Either way, no one's asked me for any, maybe I should switch deodorants?
Brian

[Autox]

Originally posted by gpassut1
It will be reconfirmed at the Drivers Meeting but as Ray stated:

"Anytime you take a passenger it becomes a "fun run" for the driver. In other words your time does not count in competition. If you ride before you drive all of your subsequent runs are fun runs."  

is the rule we will be operating under.

I am not trying to stir the pot on this on purpose but, if this is the case then Mr. Ogburn and dozens of other people have been in violation of this rule.  The competition reqs posted on the website do not specify one way or the other.  So going by a rule similar to the SCCA, 'If it is not specifically written in the rules as being allowed then it is not allowed' lots of people are in violation.  Including myself probably more than once this year.  

I thought I had been present at a membership meeting where we voted to allow non-competitors as passengers (that should tell people how long ago this might have happened)  

I am not picking on David Ogburn I just seem to remember him stating he was in favor of the change because it would allow him to take his son on his runs and not be penalized.  I could just be making all of this up since my memory isn't what it should be.

[wahoo5]

Keath,

Your memory coincides with mine. I recall the real issue being competitors as passengers. I thought we said no to that except as permitted by the OD to help a driver with serious off-course issues or to help a novice. It sounds like we need a further disucssion.

David

[GeneCooley]

I know that this goes against everything that I have ever said about passengers, but this should be a FUN event.  Why don't we allow passengers with no restrictions and just have a good time.  I might even install a passenger seat in the Fiat.
Gene Cooley

[prsrcokr]

I'm with Gene on this one, I've been hoping to ride with someone using race tires and so far haven't had a chance during fun runs.
Brian

[WWHEEE]

Originally posted by GeneCooley
I know that this goes against everything that I have ever said about passengers, but this should be a FUN event.  Why don't we allow passengers with no restrictions and just have a good time.  I might even install a passenger seat in the Fiat.
Gene Cooley

WHAT HE SAID!!!     Let's have some FUN!!!

[pipefitter]

Make it a big seat, Gene. I want a ride.

[joe]

I guess we have one more thing to discuss at the Board Meeting tonight.  

Man, I don't remember Bill Lloyd making this many changes to the Comp/Speed Regs in the last couple of seasons.  I need to work on memorizing Bill's ever-so-important line:

"No Report"

Joe

[gpassut1]

This Sunday VMSC and BRR members will be running in the first 3 heats by class.  In general class groupings will be as stock, Prepared/Modified/Street prepared, and the S categories STS/STX etc.  The order will be done by random draw.  All non-members and novices will run in the 4th heat.  There will be no exceptions so please don't ask. We are expecting about 100 cars and will try to start on time, first car off at 11:00. VMSC rules do not allow competitors to be passengers during any competition runs.  Non-competitor passengers are allowed but must sign a release and must have a wristband.

VMSC has a rule that cone penalties during a run, that results in a rerun, carry-over to the rerun. The next run after the aborted run is the rerun.

The weather forcast is good so lets have a great event.

Charlie

[lugnutz]

Call me stupid, but if you're running for serious points and a trophy, why the hell would you want the extra weight and a possible distraction in the car with you? :evil:

Like the regs say, no competitor shall ride in a car before they run and that is as it should be.

Just a thought!

Looking Forward to Sunday

Audie